There are many that are so incorrectly used, well, it frustrates me.
Hemming's, many years ago, would include in every issue what certain terms meant. It was way to educate folks.
Time to bring that back?
I'll start with one word that is way too often misused.
"RESTORATION".
I see ad after ad for a "restored" car and get excited only to open the ad and see the same car advertised with (example) 12v. "upgrade", Scot Blower, custom interior, etc.
Restoration means to bring something back ("restore") to it's original condition.
Mike "Kube" Kubarth
Next two words on the list of those words over and/or misused in this hobby are: 'original' and 'barn find'.
Dave
Recently there was an "all Henry steel" bodied car advertised. Within the same paragraph as the "all Henry steel", the seller described the numerous body panels that had been replaced.
Mike "Kube" Kubarth
This message was edited by kubes40 on 4-21-21 @ 5:23 PM
This message was edited by KentuckyCoachbuilder on 5-7-21 @ 6:26 AM
Alan
Guys, just because the car is old does not mean it is a classic. It just means it's old.
There are no "classic" Ford V8's. There is a definite criteria to be met in order for a car to be a "classic".
Definition: A Full Classic is a “Fine” or “Distinctive” automobile. American or foreign built, produced only between 1915 and 1948. Many factors come into play but, generally, a Classic was a high-priced, top end vehicle when new and was built in limited quantities. No "Mass produced" assembly line vehicles are considered Classics. Other factors, including higher engine displacement, custom bespoke coachwork and luxury accessories. Mechanical developments such as power brakes, power clutch, and “one-shot” or automatic lubrication systems, help determine whether a car is considered to be a Classic.
Mike "Kube" Kubarth
This message was edited by KentuckyCoachbuilder on 5-7-21 @ 6:26 AM
Alan
This message was edited by ford38v8 on 4-28-21 @ 6:12 PM
This message was edited by KentuckyCoachbuilder on 5-7-21 @ 6:27 AM
Modified cars are part of every car manufacturer's heritage, but I don't believe that they can or should be classified and defined on this web site. The Early Ford V-8 Club mission is: "we are dedicated to the restoration and preservation of all Ford Motor Company vehicles built between 1932 and 1953." and hot rods do not fit into that mission. Also, there are not enough people who are involved in the Hot Rod culture and use this site to get a reasonable definition of the different terms.
I respectively disagree with Mike's definition of classic. I like the dictionary definition "judged over a period of time to be of the highest quality and outstanding of its kind," which still puts it in the overuse category. Mike quoted the Classic Car Club of America's qualifications for being recognized as a "Classic" and shown on their Concourse. IMHO that is not a definition but a limiting factor used by a Club.
Two cars that I think deserve the title "classic" are Bob Hirhata's chopped 51 Mercury coupe and Nick Matranga's 40 Mercury Coupe. I personally do not like either of them, but the custom car community still holds them up as the best examples of the period.
Tom
But, just to further our conversation, "restoration" is not open (in my opinion) for you and I to offer our opinion as to what it means. The dictionary does that for us.
"Classic"... yeah, I suppose that can be defined a bit loosely if one were to "fish" a bit. However, it is in the automotive world that we are attempting to correctly define it and as such, "classic" is well defined for us by the likes of the well respected CCCA.
I do realize I am a bit of a stickler for the proper use of grammar, language and punctuation. And, at the same time, I realize I have so much more to learn. Still, I have a very difficult time accepting the fact that many do not care to learn. How can that be?
I had a boss many years ago that told me he "didn't want to learn anything new anymore". I can recall that very clearly as I was dumbfounded. He was serious!
Mike "Kube" Kubarth
Alan
Mike "Kube" Kubarth
Mike I completely agree with you on "restoration" and David on "original" and "barn find". I am with Alan on "classic" and feel that it is also used incorrectly by many people. My Lincoln is "unrestored" not "original", because service parts have been replaced and some parts have been refurbished.
"It ran when I parked it and the heads are in the trunk" rates right up there with "rust free" means there is no additional cost for the rust.
I have made up my mind, do not try to confuse me with facts.
Tom
This message was edited by TomO on 4-30-21 @ 1:24 PM
Regards, Steve Lee
Original = original.
Restored = restored. Hopefully to original specifications.
Ken
Sometime quite a while ago I saw in the Tampa Bay newspaper a Ford roadster with a Toyota pickup front end and a flathead Ford v-8 described as a "rat rod" to be entered in a run a El Mirage where it went 94 mph. These are good reasons for me to hide out here with my ownership of a 1948 Ford coupe which I then found out was a Sedan coupe and even later found it was based on the 1939 Mercury Sedan Coupe and was very different from the 1946 Ford 5-window coupe I had seen just before I was old enough to buy a car. (1954) Ford motor clearly denied I had any claim to "looks like a Super-Deluxe Ford convertible" when I made one in 3-D modelling form and attempted to post it in TURBOSQUID at the time they had successfully sued a site for using that term for ??? when they were mortgaging their trademarks and GM and Chrysler filed for bankruptcy. In 1953 the dealer in Bad Axe, Michigan gave me a windup scale model of a Ford sedan when my father bought a 1953 Ford Country Sedan in two-tone Antelope beige and Saddle tan. It was exhibiting a render of a model of that car at Yellowstone NP in 3D in memory that had led to comments that I needed to put it on TURBOSQUID.
I've been mulling over the definition of "Original". In your example you mention that the car had replacement body panels.
I'm trying to clarify original as it applies to my car. It has all its original body panels, interior, gauges. running gear and most of its original paint. My question is: if components like the gas tank, generator, mats, weather stripping, and glass for example have been replaced, does it cease to be original? Is it then a survivor only, or just another old car?
Thanks for clarifying this for me.
Brad
Some say, correctly I believe, that's it "only original once".
Mike "Kube" Kubarth
And I thank all you real Ford V8 mechanics who have shared your knowledge for the almost 50 years that I've belonged to this club.
1934 Ford's since 1972
If it were "original" all of the interior, chrome and paint would be factory, things that were considered normal maintenance items like belts, hoses, brake shoes and tires would not have to be factory.
Tom
There's currently a nice looking '34 coupe advertised as a full restoration. In the description it mentions the blower, hydraulic brakes, etc.
I'm not certain whether to laugh or cry.
Mike "Kube" Kubarth