| 49fordv8f4 | -- 05-02-2010 @ 3:01 PM |
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I am in the process of restoring a 1949 F4 truck. The original cowl to fender seal on my fenders is an extruded rubber seal that appears to be of the same material as a windshield or back glass seal and the same profile as the cowl to fender seal,(21C-16068) for a 1942-47 truck. It is also stapled to the flange of the fender like the 42-47 seal. All that I can find is the 7C-16068 seal which is a foam rubber material like a door weatherstrip. The 42-47 seal would work but they are cut too short for the 49-52 fenders. Thanks, Mark Poley
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| 51f1 | -- 05-08-2010 @ 2:28 PM |
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That seal is actually spongy, more like a door weatherstrip. It is available from any supplier of parts for the '48-'52 trucks. Richard
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| 49fordv8f4 | -- 05-09-2010 @ 9:01 AM |
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Richard, I ordered from Dennis Carpenter 7C-16068 cowl to fender seal. I did not know when I ordered it that I was sponge rubber like a door weatherstrip. It is nothing like the original seal that my truck had on it. The seal my truck has is very similar if not identical to the 21C-16068 seal for a 42-47 truck. It was stapled to the fender flange with staples about 3/8" wide and about 3" apart. My truck is an F4 assembled in Kansas City, I don't know if the trucks larger than F1 used the seal like mine or if it was a regional assembly plant difference. I have a 51 F2 parts truck, also assembled in KC, that used the same seal. Thanks for your reply, Mark Poley
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| 51f1 | -- 05-10-2010 @ 5:58 AM |
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The sponge anti-squeak was used on all of the '48-'52 conventional cabs through F-8. If you had something different, it was probably added later. Richard
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| 49fordv8f4 | -- 05-10-2010 @ 9:42 AM |
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Richard, My 49 F4 is a very original truck with 65,000 actual miles, a barn find in Kansas bought from the family of the original owner who used it as a grain truck. There is no question that the fender to cowl seal is original to the truck. I have seen and owned other 49-51 trucks with the same seal and have talked to other collectors of these models,in my search for the correct seal,that have told me that their trucks had the same seal as mine when they disassembled them for restoration. Thanks Again for your reply,Mark
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| 51f1 | -- 05-10-2010 @ 6:27 PM |
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If you check a Ford parts manual, it only lists one seal, anti-squeak, part number 7C-16068, which is a '47 part number used on '48 and later trucks, but who knows how it was made. I saw one very original '51 truck near Atlanta some years ago, and it had the sponge anti-squeak. My truck didn't have any anti-squeak when I got it, so I don't know what actually came on it, but I do know that there were no staple holes in the fender flanges like there were on other parts that have seals stapled to them. It could be that the earlier trucks had a different seal that was replaced on later models by the sponge seal with the same part number which would mean that it is a replacement for the earlier seal. I believe that Dennis Carpenter makes the sponge anti-squeak (or did before everything moved to China). He may still have someone on his staff that knows the answer. Richard This message was edited by 51f1 on 5-10-10 @ 6:42 PM
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| 49fordv8f4 | -- 05-12-2010 @ 7:01 PM |
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Richard, It is possible that the foam seal superceded the seal that my truck has. I wonder if different assembly plants may have installed the seal like mine longer than other plants did also? I have a 51 F2 that has staples in the fender flange like my 49, both assembled in KC plant. I also had a 49 F1 parts truck I recently sold that had staples and remnants of the rubber seal like mine has, it was assembled in Memphis. I don't know if it would be possible to staple the foam seal without cutting all the way thru it, But maybe they were also stapled on also, I don't know. Maybe someone can answer that. I have a foam seal set I ordered from Dennis Carpenter, but I really wanted to use a seal like my truck came with originally. I also like the looks of the original seal better. I talked to a man in the tech dept at Dennis Carpenter and told him that my truck had the 21C-16068 style seal in place of the 7C-16068 seal and asked if they would cut me a 21C-16068 seal long enough to fit my 49 fenders as the 42-47 fenders are about 6" shorter. He said that they would not do a special order and did not want to discuss the fact that my truck had a different seal than the one they sold for it. Bob Drake told me that if they hadn't sent their tooling for the 21C seal to Taiwan they would gladly walk out to the extruder and cut me what ever I needed. Now they come from Taiwan already cut and packaged. I don't mean to imply that the foam seal that everyone sells for the 48-52 trucks is not correct, it is correct and would work on my truck but I know that it is not what it originally came from the factory with.I have found through my other post on this subject,I accidentally posted the same message twice, Tom O. replied and told me of Metro Moulded Products. I ordered a seal from them and I think they have what I have been looking for. They sell their seals by the foot. I will post when I get it. Thanks Again for your reply, Mark
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| Norm | -- 05-13-2010 @ 8:58 AM |
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I have a very original '48 F-1. As the attached picture shows, there is a seal with an exposed flap between the fender and the cab from the bottom of the door (not from the running board) up to the cowl. After that it appears as if the "foam" type seal may be between the body and the fender all the way over to and down the grill. I really can't see into the joint very well, but it does appear that there's something in there. I doubt that Henry would have left it metal-to-metal. So - maybe everyone is right!! One style for part of the joint and "foam" for the rest!! Hope this helps!! Norm
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| 51f1 | -- 05-13-2010 @ 11:44 AM |
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Norm: The foam seal looks like your picture. Most of the bolted joints on the front of the truck have an anti-squeak. This oil impregnated fabric is about an inch wide and about a 1/16-inch thick. There is a list of all of the parts it's used with somewhere in the Ford parts book, but the list is hard to find (for me anyway). It comes in a coil from suppliers in a length more than sufficient for all the joints. Nothing is used between the rear fender and the bed, and nothing is used where the running boards attach to the fenders. The rubber anti-squeak (sponge or solid?) is used between the front fenders and the cab at the rear of the front fenders from the top of the fender (rear of the inner fender or apron) to below the cab, or at least the ones I have seen go below the cab. Since I was a kid when they were new, I have never seen an original or correctly restored Ford truck older than my '51 (I have been deprived)! Ain't these old trucks interesting? Richard This message was edited by 51f1 on 5-13-10 @ 12:02 PM
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| Norm | -- 05-13-2010 @ 1:10 PM |
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The Ford Truck Parts Book for 1948 to 1956 trucks lists this part as 16068 "Anti-squeak (front fender to cowl)". For 1948-1950 the complete number would be 7C-16068. If you have a copy, look at the Illustration volume, Section 160, Page 346, Illustration P-720. The G&G on-line catalog shows this part ($15 for a pair) with a picture that shows a profile that could match what's on my truck (it's not very distinct, so look carefully). The Ford book illustration shows it in the same position my picture shows. The piece on my truck doesn't seem like foam or sponge would be an appropriate decription, since it's hard and resists bending - maybe old age and elastomer degradation. Anyway, I think that's the right part. Hope this helps!! Norm
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| 49fordv8f4 | -- 05-15-2010 @ 7:24 PM |
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Norm, The fender to cowl seal 7C-16068 on your truck looks like the seal on my truck. The ones in the C&G online catalog you mentioned are the foam seals. I called them some time back and they told me that they were made by Dennis Carpenter, as are the ones Mac's sells. The foam seals have a cross section profile that looks somewhat like the letter H, although the cross bar in the H is not in the center. Two of the legs on one side are shorter than the other two, if that makes any sense. If you look inside your fender there should be another bead exposed between the fender flange and cowl very simular to the one you see on the outside, if your truck has the foam seal. The seal on my truck is T shaped in cross section. There is no bead on the inside sticking out between the fender flange and cowl.The leg of the seal that is between the fender flange and cowl is stapled to the fender flange with staples the look just like staples you see on paper, only a lot heavier. The bent ends of the staple that you would see on the bottom of the paper is to the inside of the fender flange. You can see them if they are not covered with undercoating. The exposed bead on the outside is also about 1/8"-3/16" narrower than the foam seal. Mine is about 9/16" wide whereas the foam seal is almost 3/4". The seal on my truck is also made from a dense rubber simular to a windshield glass seal. I recieved a sample yesterday from Metro Moulded Parts and it is the exact seal I have been looking for. They sell it by the foot so I ordered enough for my truck. They were out of stock but said I should have it in about 2 weeks. Thanks for your reply, Mark
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| Norm | -- 05-16-2010 @ 2:37 PM |
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Mark - Glad it worked out. I can't see what the overall profile of my seal is, but it sure could be a "T" cross section. It doesn't seem spongy at all. I wonder how this "foam" stuff got into the system!! Norm
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| 51f1 | -- 05-25-2010 @ 3:10 PM |
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Mark: A 9/16" seal wouldn't cover the gap on my '51. Maybe that's why your seal is different than the foam seal. Perhaps on later models ('51 and '52), the gap was larger. My foam seal, even being wider, tends to work it's way up and out of the gap. Richard
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| 49fordv8f4 | -- 06-07-2010 @ 8:56 PM |
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I recieved the cowl to fender seal Sat. 6-5-2010 that I had ordered from Metro Moulded Parts. It looks like an exact duplicate of the seal that originally came on my truck. So if anyone out there is restoring one of these trucks that originally came with the dense rubber seal instead of the sponge rubber type, Metro has the seal you need. Their part number is LP 15-D and can be ordered by the foot. Thanks for all the help from everyone who replied to my post. Richard, I looked at the '51 F2 parts truck I have and it only has about a 1/4" gap between the fender and cowl.You can see all the staples in the flange for the old seal. The new seal I have covers the gap nicely. There must have been manufacturing differences between the different assembly plants as you said the fender to cowl gap in your truck was larger and your truck had no staples in the fender flange. Interesting! Thanks Again Mark Poley
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| Norm | -- 06-08-2010 @ 5:47 AM |
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Mark - Thanks for the follow-up. It's always nice to know how these things come out in the end! Norm
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