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EFV-8 Club Forum / 1940 Ford Discussion / car is running rough

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TomO
04-05-2021 @ 7:13 AM
Senior
Posts: 7238
Joined: Oct 2009
          
Before you take the carburetor apart, check the spark as I said in my previous post. A weak spark can cause black sooty plugs. Another cause would be idling the engine for long periods without driving the car.

The parts available for these old cars are not the quality of the parts offered when the car was newer. You must perform diagnostic procedures to isolate the failing part. Not doing this will result in replacing good parts with parts that may not work as well and introduce new problems.

Tom

o2bnkc
04-05-2021 @ 9:52 AM
Member
Posts: 48
Joined: Mar 2021
          
I've got a good spark, but the plug is all black and sooty from just running it that short time the other day. I haven't checked the points yet. I'm kind of leery about pulling the distributor off. Can I just pull it off, check/replace the points and put it back on? Do I need to do anything special before I pull it off or put back on?

A Proud Navy Vet

ford38v8
04-05-2021 @ 5:26 PM
Senior
Posts: 2731
Joined: Oct 2009
          
Check my reply to your other thread. Two threads going at the same time is hard to follow and will conflict with each other.

Alan

TomO
04-06-2021 @ 7:47 AM
Senior
Posts: 7238
Joined: Oct 2009
          
I agree with Alan that you should let one of the topics die. My vote is to keep this topic as the title is more relevant to the problem.

I would not pull off the distributor at this time. I don't think that the problem is in the points at this time. The distributor is driven directly from the camshaft. The drive tang is off set so that it will be in time when installed properly. When you install the distributor, you must make sure that it fits tight against the timing cover, before tightening any bolts.

To replace the points, you need a distributor machine or a timing fixture.

Here is a duplicate of the reply that I posted in your other topic:

Let's start over.

Have you checked the spark for about 1/2" of blue spark at idle when the engine is at operating temperature? if you have good spark, you might have some debris in the fuel tank. Check your fuel delivery. Use the procedure below as it will show most deficiencies in fuel delivery.

To check fuel delivery, you need a graduated 16 ounce or larger container to determine the amount of fuel delivered in a measured time. Disconnect the fuel pump line from the carburetor and direct it into a graduated container. Crank the engine long enough to get 2 ounces of gas in the container and then continue cranking for 15 more strokes of the pump. The pump should have delivered 6 more ounces of gas.

If you don't get the additional 6 ounces of fuel, the most likely cause is the flex line, followed by the line from the tank, plugged pickup in the tank or weak fuel pump.

If the car passes these tests in the driveway, then take it out for short drives around the neighborhood. If it acts up, pull out the choke half way to see if it improves. If it does improve, you probably have debris in the tank.

If it does not improve, check the spark while the car has the problem and also operate the accelerator linkage while looking down the throat of the carburetor to see if you get 2 strong streams of fuel from the accelerator nozzles. One of these tests should point you in the correct direction.

Tom


Tom

o2bnkc
04-06-2021 @ 4:44 PM
Member
Posts: 48
Joined: Mar 2021
          
Here's what I've done with the fuel part, so far. The very first time I had this problem where it was sputtering and dying, I changed the inline fuel filter. It ran great. I took it on a little 40 mile drive, but coming home it started sputtering again. I was doing 50 mph and it never died, so it made the last 15 miles home. It's a clear inline filter and it was pretty clean. I took the glass bowl off of the fuel pump and cleaned it good. There really wasn't anything in there. I put it back on, cranked the engine and let it fill back up. Replaced the coil, condenser, and plugs. I left the inline filter out this time, just to make sure that wasn't the problem. Got it running pretty well. I took off for a little ride. It ran great for about 15 minutes then sputtered and died. Waited a few minutes. Started up, ran a couple of blocks and died. Did this a few times and then we towed it home. Now the electrical side. I'm getting 6 volts to the coil when I turn the switch on. This is a new remote coil, with the condenser on a plate on top of the distributer. I just got an original style coil and condenser, but I was saving these to put on later. After seeing I was getting 6 volts to the coil, I looked up under the dash and didn't see any wires going to the ignition resistor. Could that be my problem?

A Proud Navy Vet

TomO
04-07-2021 @ 9:20 AM
Senior
Posts: 7238
Joined: Oct 2009
          
If you bought the coil that fits the 1949-1955 Ford, you do not need an ignition resister. You do need to check that the thin wire going to the adapter plate comes from the + terminal of the coil if your car is still positive ground. If you bought another coil, I can't help you with the resister or connections as they are specific to the coil.

It is not unusual to get a bad new coil and they fail when hot, that is why I asked you to check your spark when the engine is up to normal operating temperature.

Your latest explanation sound like you have debris in the tank, rusted fuel line or bad flex line. You can replace the flex line with a piece of fuel rated hose temporarily to see if that is your problem. Do not leave it in permanently as it will cause starting problems.

I don't think that you have a rusted fuel line because you said that the fuel filter and the sediment bowl were clean.

Debris in the tank will float away from the pickup when the engine is not running. This gives you a short drive and then you are in trouble. The only way to eliminate this is to flush the tank.

The drain plug is usually rusted in place. The way that I remove them is soak a rag in penetrating solution and then place it around the plug. Next I fill a small foil pan with penetrant and tape it to the bottom of the tank. This will keep the rag up there and keep the rag wet. Use Gorilla Tape as it will hold heavy items. Clean the tank bottom with soap and water and then alcohol to make sure the tape will stick. Let it soak for a couple of days then use a 10" or larger Crescent type adjustable wrench to try to remove the plug. If this doesn't work, you will have to remove the tank to flush it.

Good Luck

Tom

o2bnkc
04-07-2021 @ 7:07 PM
Member
Posts: 48
Joined: Mar 2021
          
The coil is for a 40 and it says battery and distributor on the terminals, I think I got those hooked up right. I tried to drain the tank the other day. That plug is not budging. It's almost like it's welded on! Again, could it be bypassing the ignition resister and getting the coil too hot? Does this new remote coil have a resister in it? The coil was very hot to the touch. Is it supposed to be that hot? Again, the 6 volts was at the coil terminal and at the coil plug going into the distributor.

A Proud Navy Vet

trjford8
04-08-2021 @ 7:45 AM
Senior
Posts: 4189
Joined: Oct 2009
          
If the coil is hot to the touch that is not a good sign. Usually means the coil is bad/defective.

TomO
04-08-2021 @ 8:24 AM
Senior
Posts: 7238
Joined: Oct 2009
          
The coil should not be so hot that you cannot touch it.

I don't know where you bought your coils, but the 1940 Ford coil mounts on top of the distributor and takes the place of the adapter that you have. Because I don't know anything about your coil, I don't know if it requires a resistor. It is not unusual to get a bad new coil since the manufacture of them has shifted from the US to China.

Most of the guys are using the NAPA IC7 coil, for the 1949-1955 Ford.. They have shifted manufacturing to China now and the chances of a new coil failing in a few miles has increased.

The best test of a coil is to check the spark when the engine is at operating temperatures. You can get an idea of the condition of the coil by checking the resistance. The primary circuit should read 1.0-1.4 ohms across the BAT and DIST terminals on your coil and 5.8K-9.2K reading from the BAT terminal to the high tension socket.

I don't know how your coil is mounted, but most of the coils should be mounted vertical with the terminals at the top. Mounting them laying on the side can cause them to fail due to cooling problems.

Tom

37RAGTOPMAN
04-08-2021 @ 1:08 PM
Senior
Posts: 1939
Joined: Oct 2009
          
check your coil and cond and the resister on the inside firewall,
even the contacts on the back of ignition switch, to see if worn or corroded, any loose connections,?
most of the time is where the trouble lies,
have the distributer rebuilt with the coil at the same time,
also you could look at I would try it without a fuel filter,
just for testing, and see if that makes a difference,
in the fuel pump on the engine, there should be a screen for a filter ,inside under the top cap,
when you have the filter off. with the gas cap off., try blowing air though the fuel line from front to rear,
a small air compressor or a tire pump. see if you hear bubbles,
it might be over filtered,
check the fuel line front to rear and see if there is any kinks, or more filters.
also if when you are on the road, cross the terminals on the resister with a jumper wire with 2 clips and see if that makes a difference,
if it does the coil is weak,
I would suggest a good going over to correct the problem,.
my 2 cents 37Ragtopman

This message was edited by 37RAGTOPMAN on 4-8-21 @ 4:50 PM

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