| wmsteed | -- 12-06-2009 @ 9:40 PM |
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As most of us know, when it comes to old cars/trucks, being in the right place at the right time, is all to important. Case in point: I was talking on the phone with a friend of mine in Idaho yesterday. He told me that he was driving home last Wednesday when he noted a truck heading towards town with what appeared to be a '42-47 Ford pickup. He turned his outfit around and followed the truck to see where it was going. The truck turned off the hiway and headed for the industrial side of town. In short order he figured out that the truck was headed for the scrap yard. Ya know... the kind of a place that throws old cars/trucks into the crucher. My friend sped up, passing the guy so he could get to the scrap yard first. As soon as they got to the scrap yard my friend quickly exits his outfit and runs back to the truck. The driver of the truck was a Mexican that understood very little English. He did however understand money. The truck driver was cleaning up a farm, hauling all kinds of vehicles to the scrap yard for the price of the scrap. After a lot of sign language and some broken English, it was agreed that my friend would pay three times the current scrap price for the truck. The scrap price posted by the scales said the price that day was $.40 per pound ($40.00 per ton) The truck weighed just over 4,000 lbs. so my friend got a complete '42 Ford Marmon Harrington 1/2 ton 4 x 4 for $480. My brother went and looked at the truck today, calling me after he got home.. The truck is an old farm truck that has not been used for many years, however, it is complete with only the MH emblems missing from the sides of the hood. This is the second Ford MH 4 x 4 we have found since mid June of this year. The one we found in June was a '51 F-1 V8, complete in every way. Bill 36 5 win delx cpe
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| truckdog62563 | -- 12-07-2009 @ 1:37 AM |
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Wow, great story!! It's amazing to me that these trucks keep coming out of the woodwork. So few were made that finding a couple of them complete like you describe is incredible. I'd love to see pics of your trucks. Also, my friend Mark Mossell is putting together a Marmon Herrington registry and will want the trucks' information. I'll email him and have him check in here. Marmon Herrington specialist Chuck Mantiglia has given the opinion that only a few hundred per year of the half tons were produced. More of the tonners (or later F-2s/F-3s) were converted, but they were used so hard that fewer of them have survived. Your two survivors have upped the known population by a few percentage points. Stu Stu McMillan '52 F-3 Marmon Herrington V8 '52 F-3 Marmon Herrington I6
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| supereal | -- 12-07-2009 @ 9:16 AM |
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A really fine station wagon with a MH conversion was sold in the Nick Alexander auction last fall. One problem with MH was the use of special components in the front axle. I found that out many years ago when we had a utility company truck come in with a broken ring gear. I would expect that finding parts is a real challenge.
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| wmsteed | -- 12-07-2009 @ 10:48 AM |
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The heavy duty trucks that MH built probably are very hard to find parts for. However, the 1/2 tons are a completely different story; When, for what every reason Ford had,... the decision made in 1935 to offer four wheel drive through the Ford dealerships, Ford in their very practical thinking, had drive line componets made utilizing mostly standard Ford parts. The front and rear differentials in all 1/2 ton MH 4x4's use the standard Ford banjo center sections. The drive shafts are also switchable, front to rear. Fords thinking was that the majority of the vehicles would be used in rugged out of the way places, therefore repairs could be a problem if special parts were required. Ford/MH also utilized the '36-39 style drums/hub caps on all '36-48 1/2 tons, commercial cars, station wagons and passenger cars that were converted to four wheel drive. ** I know of a '48 Super DeLux coupe sitting in a barn in Montana with '39 style wheels. When my brother called me about the '42 MH he told me the only problem was that some clown had converted the hubs/wheels to the '39 style 10" bolt pattern. Of course my response was... not a problem the '39 style wheel is correct for the '36-48 MH units. It is interesting to note that when Ford made the decision to build 4x4's for the '59 model year, they carried through with their earlier thinking and used the same differentials and drive lines front and rear. I have found that if the Ford 4x4 is '59-66, F-100-250-350, the front and rear differential/drive line are the same. I know that my statement about the '65-66 F-100 4x4's will probably not sit well with some people because they have seen trucks of that period with twin I beam front ends like the early Bronco's and later F-100's. The Ford factory could have made '65-66 4x4's with twin I beams, however the ones I have seen are after market conversions. The easy way to tell is in the style of the cab, factory 4x4's have the earlier inside step well, gussets in the cab corners and the battery under the passenger floor board. The bed will be the earlier '57-60 style side or the step side bed. Bill 36 5 win delx cpe
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| truckdog62563 | -- 12-07-2009 @ 11:55 AM |
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You're right, the Nick Alexander collection was a great sale. Too bad the collection got broken up. I'm gonna have to do so reading on your comment about the front ring gear. All that I'm aware of that used the Timken split housing rear axles also used the same base axle up front with MH's own outboard components. Do you recall what model/year the truck was that you had the trouble getting the gear for? Stu Stu McMillan '52 F-3 Marmon Herrington V8 '52 F-3 Marmon Herrington I6
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| supereal | -- 12-08-2009 @ 10:20 AM |
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Stu: The last big truck with MH conversion I worked on was in the early 50's. It had the two piece "clam sh*ll" style axle, front and back. Those had to be assembled with bluing on the pinion, rotated, then disassembled to see if the mesh was correct. It was tough enough on the rears, but it was usually the front axles that gave first. Many were used by utility contractors so they could run in deep mud, etc. I was surprised that any of them lasted very long.
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| truckdog62563 | -- 12-08-2009 @ 3:35 PM |
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Yeah, I can appreciate that the rebuild of these is a p.i.t.a. That's why I had Chuck do mine rather than even considering doing it myself. But from what I've heard from him and Don Chew, the bigger truck's axles were pretty durable. According to Chuck, the 3/4 ton and tonner models got so overloaded that it's common to find fractured front axle housings on them. Thankfully I've got a couple of good ones. Stu Stu McMillan '52 F-3 Marmon Herrington V8 '52 F-3 Marmon Herrington I6
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| supereal | -- 12-09-2009 @ 6:40 AM |
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You're lucky, Stu. They used to bury the big trucks in the ditches so far that it took a dozer to get they out. How they lasted as long as they did is fairly miraculous. I think it is a testament to the MH engineering. Many people don't follow the first commandment of 4 wheeling: go as far as you can in 2 wheel, then shift to 4 wheel when you can't go further, so you can get back out. If you bury a vehicle in 4 wheel, it is usually an expensive recovery, often measured in axle and transfer case repair.
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| wmsteed | -- 12-09-2009 @ 9:39 AM |
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I have been hunting/fishing in very rugged areas of Idaho/Montana for the majority of my life. I have always followed Super's statement that 4 wheel drive was to get you out of a bad situation, not get you further in. Many years ago I was elk hunting in Idaho, driving a '79 Bronco I had. it was late in the season and we were quite high, 7,000' plus. It started to cloud up, I told my brother we were breaking camp and getting out of there while the getting was good. Brother thought I was being a whimp, after all I had that fancy Bronco with 4 wheel drive, my response was... you're right... but I don't want the Bronco wintering up in these mountains, with us trying to hiking out... As the sheep herders use to say, we got the flock out of there.... Bill 36 5 win delx cpe
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| supereal | -- 12-09-2009 @ 2:04 PM |
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I hear that, Bill. We are in the midst of a winter storm that is a rival to many seen for years. Now that so many cars, and almost all trucks, have 4WD or AWD, drivers are zipping around like it was July, forgetting that stopping is no better, and sometimes worse, than 2 wheel vehicles. That is why the ditches here are full of both! Me, I drive my 4WD pickup like an old man. Wait- I AM an old man!
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| truckdog62563 | -- 12-09-2009 @ 3:58 PM |
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I'll ditto both comments. My driver 4x4 is sitting in the barn pointed out ready for the worst. We live in the country and the road has an "S" curve as it goes past. Every winter I get to help pull fools out of my ditch. This storm missed us, but I'm sure we'll get it next. Stu Stu McMillan '52 F-3 Marmon Herrington V8 '52 F-3 Marmon Herrington I6
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| unclemark | -- 12-17-2009 @ 2:32 PM |
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please post some photos of the truck, looking forward to seeing it. Mark
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