| dbredman | -- 03-06-2012 @ 7:59 PM |
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Mike - need some info on 1940 Ford fog/driving lights.Did they only come 6" dia. or also 5" dia.? I know that Unity brand is correct and will be so marked on the housing, but should "Ford" also be on the housing somewhere? Also, is there a specific Unity model that would be correct ( F-1, F-2,ect. )? Would there be a raised portion on top of the light with the Unity name on it? Finally, are the brackets painted and what color, or would they be chrome plated? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Bruce
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| kubes40 | -- 03-07-2012 @ 6:22 AM |
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Bruce, hope the following helps: Supplied to Ford by the Unity Manufacturing Company of Chicago, Illinois, these lamps were installed only at the dealer level. Lamps were available as a kit that included a pair of lamps, one switch, and wiring. A single lamp was also available as a service part. So, while the “normal” installation would include a pair of lamps, a customer could in theory request a dealer to install only one lamp. Lamp bodies and lens bezels were chrome plated brass. The only manufacturer’s identification found on the lamp body surrounded the base. “MADE FOR FORD MOTOR CO BY’ appeared in the body to the left of the base while “UNITY MFG. CO. CHICAGO U.S.A.” appeared to the right. A special two piece slotted brass screw closed the door within a groove in the lamp body. As a result it held the door securely to the lamp body. This screw also appears in the first picture of this section under the lens and head lamp door. The related hardware consisted of numerous pieces: • Cadmium plated brackets held the lamps to the front bumper arms. In fact, all hardware was cadmium plated. • Cast into the bracket that was secured directly to the lamp base (integral of the lamp body) was “9002-S”. • Cast into the lower bumper arm clamp was “9003”. • Threaded into both the lower clamp, as well as into the lamp base, was a square head bolt. It “locked” the long bolt in place thus maintaining proper positioning of the lamp. Domestically, lenses were available in two different shades — clear and amber. A third lens, that had a clear center section sandwiched between amber upper and lower sections, was intended for export usage. Lenses were prismatic glass with five horizontal rows. Cast upon the very top center of the lens was “TOP”. Cast upon the bottom center of the lens was “9165”. Directly below that were cast “UNITY MFG. CO.”, “CHICAGO”, and finally “U.S.A.” A 32 candle power single filament bulb was secured to each silver plated reflector. A gun blued metal cover snapped over each bulb. A hole in the lamp body, internal reinforcement plate, and lamp base were fitted with a rubber grommet. Through it a cloth covered wire, either green or black, was routed. The switch appeared to be little more than a proper dash lamp rheostat with the addition of an integral fuse. The switch was secured to the lower lip of the instrument panel to the left of the steering column with a pair of 355073 S screws and 34902 S lock washers. Similar to the dash lamp rheostat a small arrow was on the very end of the knob. The knob was usually tan in color but switches with maroon knobs have been found in original lamp kits. Since the lamps were installed at the dealer level the routing of the wires from the switch certainly would have varied. However, installation instructions included in the kits advised a 5/16" diameter hole to be drilled into each fender near the bumper arm. A rubber grommet placed within that hole protected the wire subsequently routed through it. In reality, it is most likely that the wire was routed instead through the bumper arm grommets to eliminate the labor required to drill the advised holes. Once the wire from the right lamp was within the engine compartment, it was advised to route it to the vicinity of the left lamp wire (also present within the engine compartment). There, a three-way connector would secure not only the lamp wires but also the power wire from the switch. The power wire was to be routed from the three way connector along the existing wire harness and into the passenger compartment through “any convenient opening”. The power wire was attached to the “F” terminal on the switch. Another power supply wire was attached to terminal “B”. It was advised that the opposite end of this wire be attached to the battery terminal of the headlamp switch. An additional wire was attached to the “T” terminal on the switch with the other end going to the tail lamp terminal of the head lamp switch. Installed correctly, it was not necessary to have the ignition on to operate the road lamp(s). A proper installation resulted in the road lamp(s) and tail lamp(s) being lit simultaneously. This message was edited by kubes40 on 3-10-12 @ 6:35 AM
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| kubes40 | -- 03-07-2012 @ 6:22 AM |
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Another photo:
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| kubes40 | -- 03-07-2012 @ 6:23 AM |
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One more photo:
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| deuce_roadster | -- 03-07-2012 @ 7:38 AM |
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I LOVE reading this level of detail. This bodes very well for the new 40 book when it becomes available. Thanks for your attention to the little things Mike.
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| kubes40 | -- 03-07-2012 @ 11:46 AM |
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Thanks for the kind words. I am truly trying my best. I am confident I will make omissions and mistakes but am really striving to keep both at an absolute minimum.
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| dbredman | -- 03-07-2012 @ 7:51 PM |
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Mike, Thanks for the info about the fog lights. With that much info about fog lights, I can hardly wait to see the whole book.Now that I know what I'm looking for, my next qestion is, do you have any idea where I might find some? I have never seen any on E-bay or Fordbarn. Does anybody reproduce them? Again, Thanks - Bruce
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| kubes40 | -- 03-08-2012 @ 6:12 AM |
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To my knowledge no one has ever reproduced them. They can be found now and then on eBay albeit rarely. The switches are even tougher to find.
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| 39 Ken | -- 03-09-2012 @ 4:42 AM |
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Kube, Good info as usual. I'm doing a set of Drakes repos on my '39. Is the wire routing for these the same as '40? How faithful were the Drakes to the originals? Also, when you do your restorations, do you drill the hole in the fender as per the instructions or do you route through the bumper grommets? Thanks, Ken
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| alanwoodieman | -- 03-09-2012 @ 6:08 AM |
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39Ken I have an instruction sheet for installing road lamps in a 39 Ford, this sheet is by appleton and show the parts supplied and the installation of this kit. send me you e-mail and I will send you a copy if you would like to have one. Alan alan48@charter.net
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| kubes40 | -- 03-09-2012 @ 6:24 AM |
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39Ken, The Drake repops from the 1970s were actually one of the better things Drake has made in my opinion. The yellow wires he utilized should be changed out to either green or black (cloth covered)to provide an authentic appearance. Also, the switch he provided is not close to the real McCoy. As you are probably aware, the '39 lamps differ a bit from the '40 lamps. I have installed lamps before and have never had the gumption to drill a hole through the fender. Rather, I run it neatly along the bumper arm (bottom) and through the fender grommet. I have a difficult time believing a serviceman would have drilled a hole in the fender back in the day regardless of instructions. This message was edited by kubes40 on 3-4-13 @ 9:22 AM
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| 39 Ken | -- 03-09-2012 @ 10:22 AM |
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Alan, Thanks. I'll send you an e-mail Shortly. Kube, Thanks for the info. Other than the obvious difference in the way the lamp bodies are marked, The mounting brackets really have some differences. My '39 set has two extra sections between the bumper clamp and the piece that connects to the lamp body which adds about 2 1/8th inches to the height of the stand (to clear the bumper I guess). The bolt also is longer to accomodate the extra sections. I don't recall ever seeing these extra sections on other '39's equipped with road lamps. The wiring on this set is black, woven and covered with clear lacquer(?) but the size looks to better suit 12 volt as it's pretty thin. I'll change this to a larger guage. Any suggestion as to the correct guage of wire? The switch has an additional lug specifically for the tail lights. I guess that if you need fog lights on, you should have the tail lights on as well. I like the word "Gumption". I wouldn't have any either to go and drill those holes. (;>)) I'm sorry to hijack this thread but it may help with the differences between '39 and '40 Road Lamps. Ken
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| 40 Coupe | -- 03-10-2012 @ 4:51 AM |
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Although Unity is one of the suppliers to Ford for the road light, it is my understanding Appleton was an alternate, for both the road and the spot light. For Unity road lights beside what is mentioned by Kube above: The 37-38 brackets are larger two piece, the 39 bracket is three piece. They are either Cadmium or bright Zinc plated NOT painted, for all the road lights in question. NONE of the early Ford road lights have the badge on top. The wire out of the road light is #14 AWG size. The aftermarket and Ford road light till Jan. 1938 the sh*ll is marked "Unity Mfg. Co. Chicago Ill. USA" Around 1-27-38 the Ford Script road light was used. Beside the marking on the 40 road light, as mentioned by Kube above, there is an alternate "Unity S-3 Made For Ford Motor Co. Unity Mfg., Chicago USA" There are internal differences between the 37-8, 39 and 40 road lights. The 37-8 used a #1133 bulb A-18570 a single filament bulb with reflector 78-15218. The 39 used a #2330 double filament bulb with a prefocused base, the bulb socket is wired so only one filament is used and the reflector is 78-15218-B. The 40 use 1321 single filament prefocused base bulb. This message was edited by 40 Coupe on 3-10-12 @ 5:02 AM
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| kubes40 | -- 03-10-2012 @ 6:33 AM |
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There has been much deliberation over whether or not Appleton was an authorized supplier of road lamps for the 1940 Ford. The "not so simple" answer remains "no". The Appleton lamps did not come in to being until approximately March, 1941, too late to be installed upon a NEW 1940 Ford. Well, unless the new '40 sat in the showroom a LONG time. Please guys, keep in mind I am writing the '40 book with (when possible to determine) dates in mind. In other words, how the car was intended to be assembled and what accessories were available (and authorized) at the time the car would have been delivered to the original purchaser. While this approach may not set well with long held (mis) beliefs, it is based on research, not conjecture nor convenience. There are numerous things we as a group have held to be true that unfortunately, we were mistaken. I would rather not go in to more detail here. If anyone would like to pursue this "discussion" I feel a separate post is prudent.
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| 30coupe | -- 02-27-2013 @ 6:40 AM |
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Hey there, sorry to bring up an old post but I came across the website from a google search. I have been trying to find info on these fog lights that I have had for a long time. It sounds like I have the Unity's that were for export.
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| 30coupe | -- 02-27-2013 @ 6:41 AM |
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another
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| 30coupe | -- 02-27-2013 @ 6:41 AM |
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one more
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| kubes40 | -- 02-28-2013 @ 6:15 AM |
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I can't say with 100% certainty these were for export. However, as most of this type are found in Canada and the fact that other countries (outside the USA) had variations of this lens I would hazard a guess and say yes, these were intended for export. I have a set of these and think they are interesting.
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| kenburke | -- 03-02-2013 @ 5:32 PM |
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Hi Mike, Two questions. The diameter of a fog light? The color of the switch knob? Thanks.
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| kubes40 | -- 03-04-2013 @ 9:29 AM |
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Hey Ken, Well, the easy part of your question (diameter of lens) I'll answer first. The EXPOSED diameter (lamps are assembled) is 5 1/4". The lens itself is 5 3/4" in diameter. Drakes repops from the 1970's, although nice looking units have lens that are smaller than the authentic but perhaps 3/16". Okay, the tougher question(requires a longer answer) to answer: Common lore has it that all switch knobs were tan. The problem with that "theory" is it is based on service parts manuals. Those manuals and the parts listed therein, as you know, were not linked with what was authentically installed in a '40 Ford. Rather, those parts are strictly service replacement parts. I have on two separate occasions come upon maroon switches in NOS lamp kits. To me, that trumps any and all parts manuals that only list "tan" knob switches.
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